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ID: E20DD04CE1572BE2 Roll Issues

Discussion in 'Balance Discussion' started by eistgleichmcc, Jun 12, 2018.

  1. eistgleichmcc

    eistgleichmcc Member

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    Hey LTD2-Team,

    in the game above ive had a roll without ANY T5/T6 and without a major arcane Tank/Magic damage source (aquas as the only source). Please have a look into that, those rolls mustnt happen even if we won.
    I sadly failed to make a screenshot.

    Yours Johnny
     
  2. Lisk

    Lisk Director Staff Member

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    I checked the logs, and your rolls were:

    that does seem like a pretty bad roll. Anyone have ideas for this?
     
  3. Lisk

    Lisk Director Staff Member

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    Might be an interesting roll for the next Mastermind Weekly @holepercent
     
  4. foliesseer

    foliesseer Member

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    All I can say that this isn't even that uncommon. I'm not saying this happens once every 10 games, but probably once every 20 to 30 games and the first thing I do when I see that my highest cost unit is like 195 is checking if there is Reroll available :p.

    I mean, Windhawk + Tempest is actually really good with both upgrades during the mid- to lategame. And you can try to mass Aquas for 14/15 and have a Golem tank these waves. I like Buzz for a T1 since you have the flexibility of using it early game or combining it with Leviathan (Tempest Upgrade), and Ranger for holding wave 10.

    So my roll would be:
    T1 Buzz (For the early waves like 4, 5 and 6, and placing a few down at 3 to hold a send there)
    T2 Aqua Spirit (Starting Fire Elemental for 1, 2, and 3, and it's good at 7 and 8 for greeding workers.
    It also allows us to manage 14 and 15 by spamming Aqua Spirits)
    T2 Ranger (For getting Daphnes for 10 and 15)
    T3 Windhawk (It's a good unit for 6 and 9, and transitions well as a Violet during 11, 12 and 13)
    T3 Tempest (For the Leviathan Aura. And Leviathan is only really "bad" during 14, 15 and 18 in the lategame)
    T4 Mudman (For having a tank on 10 and forward, and to try to be able to hold a send on 14 or 15 with Golem(s))

    I am also pinging @Roshkatul to see what he would pick with this roll, since he probably knows this better than I do :D.
     
  5. Roshkatul

    Roshkatul Member

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    Yeah, that roll isn't that bad at all.
    I would have picked proton, aqua, ranger, windhawk, grarl and aps.
    You can easily cover wave 1 through 4 with fire elemental start, while adding a few protons here and there. Grarl can be a great tank if you expect wave 5 or 6. Aqua combo (fire + rogue) should easily have you covered on wave 7 and 8, and even though this start is weak on 9, you can just upgrade to a king claw or add a few windhawks and do just fine.
    For wave 10, you can add a few rangers, for wave 11 you should do just fine with king claw, aqua and rangers/daphnee
    For wave 12, you can add an APS/MPS for some extra backline pierce dps, since MPS is quite good with aqua/rangers, and this unit on it's own is really good on 12 if you expect a send. For wave 13 you can add a few windhawks, and upgrade them. Wave 14 can be a little bit tricky, but with rangers, daphnees, and aqua spirit spam, paired together with an MPS, can do really good. The same applies for 15, aqua spirit spam can do just fine with the debuffs from daphnees. Especially if you spam some protons, to tank the wave forever, since protons are a great way to delay the boss on wave 15.
    Later on, 16 and 17 should be easy with so much pierce backline and king claws frontline, 18 should be somewhat decent with the slow from daphnees, there should be no issue on 19, and you won't be able to hold 20, but if needed, you can slow leak it with so many cheap units and daphnees.

    So the roll is just fine, I wouldn't be mad at all having it in a game. You don't really need late game units to do good in late game. And early on, even though aqua spirits are your only arcane, they are all you need to cover the early magic damage waves, and you have a selection of units which can cover pretty much every wave in-game if needed.
     
    Lisk, ViccieLeaks and foliesseer like this.
  6. Akitos

    Akitos Member

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    That's not even close to being an awful roll tbh. Proton Aqua Ranger Grarl APS + either Gate or Mudman seems playable imo. You do have a tank and you can use APS + Aqua/Ranger spam to dish out decent dps. Most of the games aquas is all the arcane you need btw.. ^^ You really only need arcane for 7/8. On 14 you'll be fine with Aqua/Ranger + Mudman, same on 15 (you'll leak max the boss). Only on 18 you're not that great with this roll, but most games are decided before that anyway and you're not all terrible either.