1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Mastermind Lords Tournament Feedbacks

Discussion in 'Tournaments & Leagues' started by Seraphin, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. Seraphin

    Seraphin Member

    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    143
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Hello everybody !

    The first tournament I organized has ended up and again thanks to the participants, casters, viewers, and Devs support. Also, I take this opportunity to apologize concerning players who would love to participate to the tournament but cannot because of their elo. However, since I'm alone to organize the tournament, I cannot manage a tournament with 30+ teams.


    So, I noticed some frustrations and some point I could improve for the next tournament that I would like to organize for February about.
    I accept ANY feedbacks which is explained and constructive.

    I know that I can do better concerning communication, promotion of the tournament and better organization with cast (again, sorry for this delay difference between 2 casts!).

    All things I will talk about is for a tournament with 20-24 teams. Not more :

    A - Possible Formats:

    1) Keep this format. One day of 6 games in Swiss format and another day with quarter final, semi final, 3rd place final (BO1) and final in (BO3).

    2) Go back to the previous format used for the official tournament. 2 days of 5 games.

    3) 2 days tournament : first day in Swiss format with 7 games. Day 2 with quarter final, semi final(BO3) and final in (BO3).

    4) 3 days tournament : first day in Swiss format with 5 games and same for day 2. Day 3 with
    quarter final, semi final, 3rd place final (BO1) and final in (BO3).


    5) 3 days tournament : first day in Swiss format with 5 games and same for day 2. Day 3 with quarter final (BO1), semi final (BO3) and final in (BO3). No 3rd-place final.

    6) 3 days tournament : first day in Swiss format with 6 games. Day 2 with quarter final (BO3) and semi final (BO3). Day 3 with 3rd-place final (BO3) and final in (BO3).

    7) Something else.

    You can vote about what you prefer by writing A-number (so A-3 for example). If you choose option 7, please explain the format you propose.

    B - Start Time:

    As you saw, the tournament started at 7pm CET both day. The first day finished at 11pm CET about and the second day finished at 10:15pm CET about. Maybe you prefer to start another time. Also, I cannot organize a tournament another day. So, it will be necessary during the week end. Friday could also be fine for me since I can go back from my work earlier. I still want to precise that on Friday, I don't think the tournament can begin earlier than 7pm CET. Also, this will be still really hard for NA time zone.

    1) Keep this time. Start at 7pm and finish at 11pm about CET.

    2) Start at 6:30pm and finish at 10:30pm about CET.

    3) Start at 6:00pm and finish at 10:00pm about CET.

    4) Start at 7:30pm and finish at 11:30pm about CET.

    5) Something else.

    You can vote about what you prefer by writing B-number (so B-3 for example). If you choose option 5, please explain the format you propose.


    C - Reward:

    For this tournament, I proposed badges for the first 3 teams. Maybe you would prefer something else ?

    1) Badges for first 3 teams.

    2) Badges for everybody and special badges for first teams.

    3) No badges and having a cash prize

    3) Badges for first 3 teams and having a cash prize.

    4) Badges for everybody and special badges for first teams and having a cash prize.

    5) Something else.

    You can vote about what you prefer by writing C-number (so C-3 for example). If you choose option 5, please explain the format you propose.
    This is just a poll about the reward. I cannot promise anything about it contrary to others questions !


    D - Tournament type:


    1) 2v2 Mastermind only

    2) 2v2 Mastermind and Legions

    3) 4v4 Mastermind only

    4) 4v4 Mastermind and Legions

    You can vote about what you prefer by writing D-number (so D-3 for example).


    If you have any other suggestions about a poll, please DM me on the forum. Feel free to give your opinion!
    Thank you in advance for your feedback and support !


     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2018
    ViccieLeaks likes this.
  2. Bonny

    Bonny Member

    Messages:
    33
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    8
    First of all nice job u did the last 2 days!!

    A- I don't think u can manage a 3 day tournament, since not all NA players can't play on friday morning. The only possibility i see can be 2 weekends so lets say 3-4 days as a max. But i definitely like the idea of 7 games/day since its getting less rng who will be qualified then.

    B- I like it as it is, seems to work for almost all!

    C- I think a badge for the first 3 players will always be awesome. Maybe if the player base is big enough prize money is a good thing (i would suggest this maybe for 4vs4).

    D- i like options 1 and 4, as i mentioned in my post this are the most competitive layouts u can have.

    Ah almost missed this one: make semi- finals as well as rank 3 game (only if there is prize money) and finals a Bo3.
     
    Lisk and Seraphin like this.
  3. Seraphin

    Seraphin Member

    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    143
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Well, I don't think it is possible to have semi final in BO3, 3rd-place final in BO3 and a final in BO3. It would mean that we start at 7pm and we finish about 2am CET...That's not really possible. At least for me ! XD
     
  4. Bonny

    Bonny Member

    Messages:
    33
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    8
    in this u might have to split the streams up like today maybe, i know this is not perfect but a bo1 with prize money feels like a gamble
     
  5. Seraphin

    Seraphin Member

    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    143
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Thanks Bonny for your feedback. I would like more feedback here please ! It is really important for the next tournament.
     
  6. Marchombre

    Marchombre Member

    Messages:
    157
    Likes Received:
    91
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Hey !
    First of all, that was a great tournaments, great job !

    now:
    I would go with the following:
    A-3 or A-7
    B-1
    C-1 or C-3
    D-1


    A few explanations why:
    A-3: I think hosting a 3-days tournaments isn't really possible, especially with players alla around the world, and timezone issues.
    Having swiss in 7 matches will avoid some pb we had. And BO3 in semi would feel great.

    now, you could go that way, but it would be much more time-consuming:
    A-7:
    1st & 2nd day (Saturday & Sunday) : Swiss - 5 matches (maybe more if enough teams, the more, the better as long as it fits in schedule, right ?)
    3rd day: (Saturday, one week later): Quarter - BO3
    4th day: (Sunday) Semi - BO3 & Finals - BO5

    In this format:
    - You got a fair Swiss part
    - Teams can't be out in Quarter on 1 bad game (RIP King)
    - Hype will build up in the week between Swiss and the Quarter - Semi - Finals

    but:
    - you need to lock 2 week-ends
    - getting late on schedule will be hard to catch up on (can't afford something like, randomly chosen exemple, 2 streams not being synchro :p)

    possiblities:
    - do Semi same day as Quarter & keep Finals only on Sunday


    B1: I do think that's the only way to make it work for maximum timezones

    C-1: This one will be a casual tournament, family ambiance. Easy to do (icons still fairly easy to make).
    C-3: that's when things get serious. Tryhard will be real (I mean even more). But that's not a bad thing. You need to find how to get the cash price tho :p

    D-1: Two things:
    - Tournaments should match the ranked queue.
    - Easier to find a team and sign up
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2018
  7. Jules

    Jules Developer Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,524
    Likes Received:
    1,751
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I think the tournament went really well. Great job, Seraphin!

    My personal thoughts:
    - 2 days (Saturday and Sunday) is necessary due to time zone differences
    - Keep it to one weekend. Having it span over multiple weekends will cause people to drop
    - We should have signups be shorter (3 weeks instead of 6 weeks) but more aggressively advertise it
    - Swiss with 6 games on day 1. Can do 7 if you want, but I felt like 6 was the sweet spot. If you go 3-3 and don't make it in due to tiebreakers, you can't really complain
    - Make day 2 Bo1 Double Elimination (see below)

    2018-11-28_22h03_13.png
     
  8. Seraphin

    Seraphin Member

    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    143
    Trophy Points:
    43
    You're talking about A-3 then not A-2 ?

    As Jules said, I feel it is too much complicated for people to lock 2 weeks end in a row. I can foresee some drops indeed !

    I don't really agree with you here. If you look at this tournament, the skill was here and people tryhard a lot even if there was not any money to win !
    But I agree that is different of money cash prize.

    Yeah I agree this is not interesting to open signups so early. Usually, people don't really know if they are available the tournament week-end. Also, could you detail about how you would advertise the tournament more aggressively ? I mean, I try to keep the topic updated as max as I could, you advertised it in a patch note and on discord. I don't really know how I could advertise it better with what I have to be honest ^^. I could ask Akitos/LForward to promote the tournament eventually. Also, you couldn't see, but I talked with a lot of high elo players before the tournament to "attract" them. It's like this Romawear was coming back to the game ^^

    I agree. And 7 games feel still too long. However, I would say it depends on elo restriction. I mean, if it's a tournament with a 2k elo peak rating, maybe 7 could be okay. But if the average is 1700 for example, maybe it is, indeed, better to stay on 6 games ?

    I really like this idea. But does it mean finals are still in BO1 ? I feel a bit sad to have a final in BO1. I mean, the feeling would be the same as for the semi final during my tournament no ? :(
    But yeah this is clearly a good way for quarter and semi final ! You cannot really say you are out of the tournament just because of unluck!

    Thank you very much @Jules and @Marchombre for your feedback ! Still would like more if possible please ^^
     
  9. Marchombre

    Marchombre Member

    Messages:
    157
    Likes Received:
    91
    Trophy Points:
    28
  10. Jules

    Jules Developer Staff Member

    Messages:
    1,524
    Likes Received:
    1,751
    Trophy Points:
    113
    For the next one, we will make announcements on social media and include reminders in patch notes more frequently.

    Yes, but it's still double elimination. If the winner of the winner's bracket loses in the finals, they get another chance and the finals have a second game. No one can complain about losing once and getting knocked out, since everyone will have a second chance.
     
  11. Seraphin

    Seraphin Member

    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    143
    Trophy Points:
    43
    To be honest, I don't really like final format. I mean, if you win the first game in final but loose the second one you loose the tournament so finally, you don't care about the first game in final since it does not influence the win :s
    I would say all what you proposed before the final is really cool for sure and I think I will apply it for the next tournament. But for the final, I still think we should have a BO3.

    EDIT: After reading again, I understand finally that the winner of looser bracket need to have double win to win the tournament when the opponent just need one more victory. It feels a bit unfair I think.